MIL/DET

[RyanM84]

Trades:
RF: Isidro Delgado (90) = 28 - 6.000.000 - Arbitration - 2056

Trades:
1B: John Love (68/80) = 20 - 32,300 - Arbitration - 2059
2B: Nick MacMurrich (84) = 23 - 500k - Arbitration - 2057
SP: Ramon Archibequl (55/82) = 18 - 23,500 - Arbitration - 2059

I accept this trade. I deal a replaceable bat in Delgado for a young utitialy player in MacMurrich who should slide right in and play 2B for me and 2 prospects that I will take a gamble on. Nice trading with GB.

[Geaux Blue]

Accept, not big on moving Mac but I think Delgado is a very nice 2 hitter and fills a hole.

[jps93]

approve

[AndyP]

At initial glance this seems very weak for a return...

[Geaux Blue]

Don't do this very often but i'd like to explain why this deal doesnt warrant a veto by any means. First off, I believe if MacMurrich were rated an (87) no one would bat an eye. He certainly has the vitals to justify such a rating. The guy is a switch hitter that can play multiple positions and has 87 eye, 78 power, 96 eye. His home position is 2B and I believe he'd be one of the better players at that position in the file if he got enough at bats. Oh and he produces, sure it's in 557 ab's over 3 seasons so far but he's produced an .846 OPS but so far in his young career his numbers have proved his vitals right. Also, he's not even arbitration eligible till after the '57 season. I really believe his (84) rating has him undervalued and he's a very valuable player to have. After saying all these wonderful things about MacMurrich why would I move a guy that plays a hard position to fill? Bart Ahearn is blocking him for the forseeable future. The prospects I gave up aren't great by any means, i'm not really a fan of Love and that's why I didnt mind dealing him. Archibecqui I have some belief in, sure he doesnt look to become a future star but his vitals and overall/peak look solid right now and he has a lot of possibility for growth. I like him as a prospect.

The player i'm getting back is Delgado (90). He has fancy vitals and although he's a righty looks to has switch hitting vitals. Through a little over 2000 ab's he sports an .836 OPS which is impressive along with good to solid defense. He's also 28 and will be a FA in a couple years. He's a really good corner outfielder and im guessing the reason Ryan would move him is he believes Espin will take his place and in time produce well for his Brewers while he gains a nice 2B that plays for him right away and gets a solid prospect along with one I myself isnt that high on.

The above is why I believe this deal is far from a veto by any means at all.

[AndyP]

Here's the thing, he's not an 87, so that hypothetical really doesn't matter a ton. Here's my problem:

1) Milwaukee just paid a heavy price for a 2B (Major), why pay an even higher price for another?

2) Why is Milwaukee dealing one of their cheapest impact players?

3) These prospects are both subpar and don't nearly make up the difference

4) Delgado is a far better hitter than his OPS or ratings indicate

If the prospects are upgraded I still might not like this because I don't see what Milwaukee is trying to do here. If they're moving talent off the best team in the file, it better be the really expensive ones. Not Delgado.

I'm voting veto.

[mattynokes]

I agree with Andy.

1. Delgado is damn good. Might as well consider him a 94 since Mogul heavily weights power for corner players and he still actually hits for power, just not in home runs. If this were someone like Dan Frost, who gets much more hype and talk, and I think DET would be giving up way more. However, even though Frost looks more appealing vital-wise, Delgado smokes him in the XBH/150 G department 57 to 46. Delgado owns a career .371 wOBA while Frost's is at just .340. And for our file, Delgado is very good defensively in RF.

2. MacMurrich has done well so far, but it's a small sample size. Even if he continues to hit, he's not that good defensively. In fact, his vitals are probably a little below average (going off of the averages I did years back, they are).

3. Why another 2B? Ryan is definitely allowed to do what he pleases, but it's concerning when at the beginning of the season hardly anyone is available and then now, seemingly in panic mode, everyone is available, yet MIL is still trying to compete? Dealing away great talent isn't going to help a WS run.

4. Back when Ryan initially said he was looking for a 2B upgrade, I mentioned a MacMurrich for Hillyer swap since it met both team's needs. Whether there's mutual interest or not, isn't the point. The point is it would have been a fair swap. I don't know who would think you can basically swap Delgado for Hillyer and think it's a good deal.

[Geaux Blue]

I'm interested in why this is getting such great attention yet there are trades every year that are worse than the one we are talking about?

Barroca was just dealt for absolutely nothing of value. At the time of the deal he was a 88 with outstanding vitals and very good past success. He was swapped for nothing of any real value. These types of deals happen every year and nothing.

Maybe this is an issue for another time but I really don't feel these vetoes and non vetoes carry any semblance of consistency at all.

[mattynokes]

Comparing Barroca to Delgado is apples to oranges. Barroca is declining. Delgado is not. Barroca was owed around $60M. Delgado is not. I would agree that JPS got very little in return, but he got out from under a sinking ship. He got a lot of salary relief at the right time (while Barroca was hurt) before he dropped even more. Barroca is starting to take some bigger hits on his drops and might not last through his contract.

[Geaux Blue]

I'm not comparing the players, i'm comparing the value given in return. I don't think Barrocas deal is any big detriment to a team in the early stages of a rebuild but that's just my opinion.

Either way it is what it is, i'll move on.