HOU-ATL

[piazza31]

what do you want for my life?
Tincher is a valuable upgrade over guttierez who has no pitches
Chitty helps upgrade at 3b and gives tarrant time in the minors
The draft after 15 picks is in the upper 80's category
my 2nd rd pick projected is a 60/83 or a 57/84 range
my 3rd rd pick projected is a 62/81
my 4th rd pick projected is a 56/79
after that it drops off even more for 5th and 6th why does that make me feel like my 2nd or 3rd would even come close to chitty or tincher? maybe one pick surpasses one of them 2-4 years down the road yay by than the pick will be useless on my team

Now, if you request that a deal be held up over valuing of picks thats positively rediculious due to the fact that its already approved and both me and dj are happy with this deal

[dejota]

For the record Andy's just doing his job. We've got to find away to disagree more respectfully going forward it really upsets some GMs (some who may not even be involved) to watch people flame each other. If you can't type a reply without being rude try just typing facts and nothing more because at the end of the day the goal is the same: a fun and long-living league.

I agree with Rocky's assessment (obviously) and I think while the value for DPs is high in FCM it's probably a tad on the overrated end. I can't completely speak for Piazza but if sees the same things I saw in Chitty when I picked him up from COL I don't see this as an overpay at all. I think if Chitty's name were Adam Dunn this trade wouldn't even be question but b/c we have so much talent 93 power doesn't equate to around 35-40 HRs like I personally feel it should.

If the 2nd rounder was the 86 or 87 peak I'll get the 3rd was a 84 peak and so on it'd look a lot less intimidating on paper as I think Piazza is trying to get at. I don't know if that's the best point of view since I'm involved in the deal but it's where I'm at with it anyways.

[piazza31]

my point of view is chitty is a 90+ power bat with 90+ eye and 74 contact
hes the definition offensively of adam dunn with an actual deffense
my point on picks is that a 84 peak a 81 peak a 79 peak a 77 peak a 75 peak for an upgrade offensively and deffensively and a starting pitching upgrade is not a bad deal in any way shape or form i value dps highly but 25mil cash for these 2 i would take anyway (my value of the 5 picks)

i find it more rude to have a deal held up AFTER It has been approved just because one mod disagrees thats immoral for leagues

[dejota]

I don't think the value has much to do with the peak once you dig past the surface of DPs, the value lies a lot in the fact that we're fortunate to have some really good drafters in FCM. For me an extra 5 picks is generally going to produce two players like Chitty and Tinch and probably another bench player. Speaking for myself that makes it really easy to see guys gutting their draft and to take offense until I remember that it's still 50/50 and if you're not completely comfortable with the class or your drafting abilities you may not see those picks in the same vein.

And it's true, those DPs in the right hands is pure gold but give them to somebody else and the value flops heavily in the other direction. That's why there's two differing and valid POVs here.

[piazza31]

exactly

[AndyP]

is not a bad deal in any way shape or form i value dps highly but 25mil cash for these 2 i would take anyway (my value of the 5 picks)

Why is this so hard to explain then? I asked simple questions because I'm doing my job. I'd love if it didn't always have to be me, but I'm continually thrust into that role. Whether you want to accept it or not your Pulgarin deal was a massive red flag that you don't understand what you're doing.

You accepted that awful deal with Cincinatti, now you need to accept that it has put into serious question your ability to GM this team. More than a handful of GMs have come in and done to teams what you're doing now, not realized the errors they were making, and then bailed when they saw the end result of their mistakes.

I will not hand another great GM like DLee another horrid team like Philadelphia. And if it hurts your feelings to explain your reasoning better to do it - so be it. Grow up, answer the questions, because they shouldn't be hard if you have good reasons.

It's that simple.

[piazza31]

lmao i get the "don't be rude or obnoxious" but really that has to take the cake from andy
My cincinatti deal had many reasons for being approved and i still agree with that, mods like you sicken me with your oh because we had one or 2 bad gms that every new gm must show his worth before making a "questionable deal" if you can't handle a gm questioning your job for being an asshole to every new gm than don't be a mod but to explain everything to this deal in lame man terms
I gain a 3b who can hit for 30-40 hrs and field good as well as gain a .350 obp
I gain a sp who can win 12-16 games per year and put up good numbers with his 90+ control and 82 movement with all 75+ pitches yes these are good. I give up draft picks that I'm not good at while drafting as DJ said some gms are gold diggers others are not. I feel draft picks are better off getting me something I can use instead of wasting them and hoping for good luck when i get screwed 2-3 years down the road when they become 79 overalls or lower

[AndyP]

lmao i get the "don't be rude or obnoxious" but really that has to take the cake from andy
My cincinatti deal had many reasons for being approved and i still agree with that, mods like you sicken me with your oh because we had one or 2 bad gms that every new gm must show his worth before making a "questionable deal" if you can't handle a gm questioning your job for being an asshole to every new gm than don't be a mod

Your first Cincinnatti deal was terrible. Horrible, foolish, and short-sided. This can be easily proven. A deal, with the same GM, netted MUCH more talent just a few days later. Hence, the value in that first deal was clearly poor because the other party had been willing to give up MUCH more, you just didn't have the sense to ask for it. So, again, a huge red flag on top of already growing concern over the Lomax deal.

I won't question a new GM if they are making sound moves that I can see the reason in, when deals present red flags - I will. You have presented plenty of red flags.

It is absolutely my job to make sure you don't wreck a team and then bail on them. Because we can't undo the damage if you do. We can only catch it in the act. That's my job and I ask questions to get you to show that you actually put thought into it. You brought attention to yourself with the wildly low value you got for Pulgarin the first time. That's your fault, now grow up and live with the consequence.

This deal is approved.

[GoIrish]

done